And bashing begins. At least they dare to let then fight instead of the prefictable 1-2 at Mercedes and Ferrari. Max made moves Ricciardo made wrong choices and they crash. Racing accident and no more. Both were driving over the limit so why it’s only Max fault again?

It is more Max faults because he should leave enough space for Danile to get free air. When he took all space inside he also took downforce and grip from Daniel. That lost grip then caused the accident. Also Max was already moving from inside towards outside and then moved back blocking inside just in begin of breaking zone. A smart driver in that point would avoid accident leaving just enough space for one in behind have free air to break with full grip.

Plus rules say "More than one change of direction to defend a position is not permitted. If a driver has moved off the racing line while defending their position, they may move back but must ensure there is at least one car’s width between their own car and the edge of the track."

source: www.formula1.com/e(...)_and_penalties.html

Yeah I agree with Pauli, and would like to add that its not about bashing, or at least not unfairly so (remember, I can even defend Hammy at times).

He moved for the breaking zone. It’s visible by the onboard cam. They both took to much risc. This is racing so why pointing a finger.

Ricciardo is more to blame did he really expect max to leave space? Picture this ... turn the scenario around would you still blame the guy in front?

Both took risk but IMO Max and Seb are once who are taking most unnecessary risk when defending position. Basically issue to me it that Max SHOULD leave enough space inside so accident can't happen if he knows Daniel is going inside. I assume he knows Daniel is going inside but defends like Kart driver instead of Formula driver.

Accident wasn't only case where I feel Max was a bit too aggressive when defending against Daniel that already earlier risked accidents.

Pauli, Please get real. You don’t leave the door open. Why did DR choose the inside. He would never be able to get his braking point.

My issue is that Max moved twice, which is against current regulations.

And yes Boudy, I would've found it equally weird, because its against said regulations to move twice. But it wasnt, and Ricciardo generally dont pull such moves. If you move to the outside, shouldnt it be safe for the other dude to try and get you from the inside? That is why I said what I said above. I dont dislike Max, I think he is a skilled driver, maybe even champion material, but its been how many times now? Max had made his move, Ricciardo moved in for the strike, Max moved again. Now I could understand rash moves if he was racing anyone else, but against this own team mate? Remember, earlier in this race, Ricciardo went wide to avoid a similar incident to happen, again with his team mate.

The so called ' Verstappen Rule' was dropped last year, so moving under breaking is not against the rules. It was replaced by 'moving erratically or dangerous' The stewards reprimanded both RIC and VER after the race, and left it at that. So we can point fingers all we want... For me the point is, one could see this coming from a mile away, they touched before, and neither was going to give in. RB pit wall should have stepped in. They didnt, so they cannot fault the drivers now, they both did what they get paid for.
And yes, Hammie got lucky, didnt see him all race, but walks away with the bubbly... it s not always fair...
Great race to watch, great season so far!

Fair point, but moving back and forth like that isnt what I'd call "safe" either. But I agree that RB shoulda cooled them off.
He did a good job for sure. Just wish it'd been Bottas instead, if any Merc' driver, but either deserved the honour.

@calle Dont get me wrong, that bubbly should have gone to Bottas, at no point in the race did HAM deserve the win. Funny to see how RAI gets back out of losing position 2 GP in a row now...the No2 drivers are staging a revolution ;)

What a season it's got it all. This season is already turning out to be an classic; so much drama. However just because Max has a lot involvement in issues that doesn't mean that he is responsible for that issue. British commentary is biased towards certain drivers so is marshalling of the GP. As an sidenote: I don't think Redbull cares since their airtime must be through the roof.

For sure agree there Boudy, this looks like an amazing season. While I did watch the Sky airing, they are generally pretty fond of Max. But admittedly, media is media, and they will try to make a story out of anything, even if it means selling out something they actually like. I will probably still think Max were the more faulty party here, but either way this was a great race. Its hard to say whether I liked this race or Bahrain more.

I know pretty sure that if Max had been in Ricciardo’s position, everyone would blame Max

I put some real thing into my arguments then if you want:

In formula high speed grip levels are heavily influenced by downforce. When cars follow on same path the second car behind loses large amount of downforce that affects cornering and breaking distance. By blocking inside completely Max was taking a huge risk that reduced grip simple forces exactly like this accident. If he leaves inside open for exactly a car width then Daniel has mostly free air and about similar grip and breaking distance to Max.

Now to actual analyses if blocking inside is profitable or not for Max:
I assign around 80% that Max would keep his position if no accident and completely blocking inside. But there is 20% chance that Daniel losse too much grip and there is accident.
Without completely blocking inside Max would make it possible that Daniel might overtake from inside but Daniel would risk locking tyres and having too little exit speed after corner to keep the position. I estimate that Max would have about 60% chance to keep the position. But chance for an accident would be much smaller like 1%.
They were racing for 12 and 10 points (possible 15 and 12 but I don't take that into account here)
Expected points for blocking inside would be (12p*0.8+10p*0.2)*0.8+0p*0.2=9.28p
But much better expected points for leaving a car width open would be (12p*0.6+10p*0.4)*0.99+0p*0.01=11.088p.

This shows why even from driver perspective closing a side complete just before breaking is losing move even from drivers perspective. But to understand why teams really should not allow this and be very strict teaching drivers not to do it to each others is following numbers from teams perspective.

Expected points when blocking completely: (12p+10p)*0.8+0p*0.2=17.6p
While leaving the car width open would produce much improved (12p+10p)*0.99=21.78p

Basically team is losing on average there over 4 points each time drivers end up to that aggressive defensive situation.

Nice calculation! Appreciated.
Still the blame on agressive defence(Max). How about Ricciardo’s perspective? In the position he was in, he would never get around the corner. If he had chosen to go outside, there would be 100% no accident. It’s all speculation ‘if’. It has happened and both are to blame. Your calculation blames the defender who had the right to keep his line.
What happened to the fact that someone who collides in from behind is wrong? He surely knows he losses drag if you are so close behind an other car or isn’t that worth mentioning?

Patent, you forget that Max first switched to the outside. If one driver ahead of you switches to the outside, and leaves little room there, what position will you try to overtake in?

Lets end the discussion. I remind you of the fact that you only look on what Max does. Ricciardo seems no point of discussion. A bit one sided, don’t you think?.

Of course. Not necessarily, especially considering Im no Ricciardo fan or Max hater.

By the way, thanks for an interesting discussion everyone. I enjoyed the chat, regardless if we agree or not.

Because, as much as I generally dont like their high honchos (spelling?), they want to let their drivers race. It was clear that Ricciardo was the faster driver this round, yet they refused to use team orders, for better or worse. I can respect that. But this was a dreadful result for them. To have managed that strategy so well, only to have it all crash and burn...

He had a pretty bad outlap.

Max was quicker than RIC.